Erika Lust Talks Making Feminist Porn And Directing Sex On Screen

Porn is a BIT of a taboo topic, right?

Well, it doesn't have to be. That's why we spoke to award-winning porn maker Erika Lust all about the industry, to clear up all the misconceptions, and to kick-start some actual real life conversations about sex and sexual pleasure. Because even though sex is everywhere in topless Daniel Craig movie moments and in booty shaking music videos, we never have CONVERSATIONS about sex.

And what with some mainstream porn presenting pretty troubling ideas about how sexual relationships should be, it's no wonder people get the wrong end of the stick.

Here's Erika, who's making very different kinds of adult films, to talk a whole lot of sense:

When did you first decide you wanted to make porn, and why?

It wasn’t really a decision, I didn’t wake up one day and say: 'I'm going to shoot explicit sex for a living!' It was a progression. As I was growing up, like many other young adults, I wanted to explore my sexuality more. I felt intrigued by pornography but I was hugely disappointed when I actually watched some films - they were ugly and the behaviour towards women was sometimes so degrading and violent. I felt aroused physically but I was uneasy. I just couldn’t understand it - it was basically men having sex to women and women engaging in sex for men, and all the scenes were stripped of intimacy, context and cinematography.

I didn’t start studying filmmaking until I moved to Barcelona after my degree in political science and gender studies, which gave me a knowledge base on which I could build my ethical adult cinema movement. It became clear to me that porn was not "only porn": it was a discourse on sexuality. I didn’t agree with the statement on sexuality and gender roles that mainstream porn was making, which is why I decided to create an alternative. I started to direct adult movies that I would like myself and that I thought other women and men looking for something more fresh, erotic, sensual and actually sexy would also like, and from there Erika Lust Films grew.

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What’s different about your porn from mainstream porn?

Everything is different! In the vast majority of mainstream porn male pleasure is the ultimate goal - the scene typically unfolds through the male gaze and the cumshot seems to be mandatory to end the scene. The female character is being used to satisfy others, but not themselves. While there are many categories, tags and labels that cater to every fetish imaginable, in the end it’s all the same. There’s no passion, no intimacy, no foreplay, no caressing… they’ve taken the humanity out of the pursuit of real pleasure in sex. Why can't we watch sex on screen with equal pleasure for everyone, with respect, with cinematic values?

In my company the production crew and office team are predominantly female, so the whole process happens from a female point of view, where women's desires are portrayed as well as men's. Sometimes in the industry people consent to be in films that are meant to look non-consensual – I definitely don't want to portray anything like that. I want to send out a positive message about sexuality and the culture of consent so you won't find delusions of male power that are degrading to women, coercions, representations of incest or simulations of paedophilia in my films. I always say the same: sex can stay dirty, values must be clean.

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That means I can shoot any kind of practice as long as it shows consent and communication. Even if pornography is entertainment, it’s accessible to everyone now and it has a huge influence on people, especially when there’s a lack of sex education. I feel we have a responsibility to portray sex that’s realistic and hot, where the culture of consent is paramount and there’s communication, and diverse bodies and sexualities.

The production process and the working conditions of performers are also key for us and we invest a lot in every short film, which translates into high cinematic values. The first reaction when people see an XConfessions intro is, 'This is not porn! This is cinema!'

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How does feminism fit into porn?

A lot of people think that feminism and porn don’t go together because the woman is always the object of an assumed male audience's gaze but I find that patronising. Women are sexual. Women also like to watch sex on screen. Just because a specific type of heterosexual man has dominated the mainstream porn industry for the last 40 years, it doesn’t mean it belongs to them. Introducing feminism into porn results in innovative, refreshing, realistic and sexy adult cinema.

We shoot cinema like in any other indie film but we add explicit sex and feminist values. Male characters are human beings, not machines, and women have their own sexuality and desires and are not passive objects exclusively focused on pleasuring the men. Women have a voice in the story and they seek their own desire. There’s a mutual exchange of pleasure and respect and consent is always paramount. We are creating a new wave of erotic cinema with a gender-equality conscience. It is not just good erotic cinema. Pornography made with feminist values represents people as subjects, it promotes role equality. That's it.

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Although my films do feature the female gaze and I am myself a feminist, I think there are a lot of misconceptions that my films are female exclusive. I’ve always tried to make my films accessible to everyone, male and female alike, and people have really responded to that. I think it would be wrong to assume that men are only interested in mainstream porn because intimacy and tenderness, and appreciation of a good film, aren't gendered values – men are also interested in those things. I’m very pleased that I've gained a large male following, it just indicates the movement towards equality is becoming stronger.

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When done right, adult films can empower women by allowing performers to take ownership of their sexuality and by presenting images of women taking ownership of their body to the audience. 

What is the most common misconception about porn and porn making?

I'd say the most common misconception is that porn is sex. That the way you have sex in porn is the way you should have it and enjoy it in your real life. 

Regarding porn making, there are several. The first that comes to mind is that female performers are all there against their will. It’s true that there are many cases where women who’ve just turned 18 are persuaded to get involved without knowing a lot more, which is why it’s so important that people ask themselves, ‘Where does my porn come from? Do I know who the director is? How was that scene done? Were they all consenting?’ However, the female performers that I work with are 100% enthusiastic to be involved. They went into the industry because they wanted to explore their sexuality. They knew they wanted this as a job and knew about the consequences. Because sex work is work. Unfortunately, while lots of female performers really enjoy their work, there’s a huge disparity between the pay of male and female performers, which just further entrenches the societal belief that for women sex is a chore which, again, is sexist and patronising.

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The other misconception is that you become millionaire when you work in porn. That’s a lie. A performer's fee can range from €500 to €1000 per day of shooting. However, since the tube sites have completely disrupted the adult industry, performing in adult cinema is no longer as lucrative as it once was, with many performers taking on side jobs. Most of the adult cinema performers also do webcamming, live erotic performances and engage in other activities to create a brand around their name, gain fans and become well known. That’s the way for performers to gain financial security. When a performer has many different income revenues and treats their career as a business that has to be handled professionally and responsibly, then they can save for the future. It’s hard work. 

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Why is there a stigma around porn?

Because it explicitly shows something society is very afraid of: sex and pleasure. We don't talk about sex. How are we going to talk about porn?! The problem, as stated recently by a well-known performer, is that porn (unlike other media) often sidesteps scrutiny because people are unwilling to talk about it in public. Even today some sexual activities are deemed more obscene than others - they are stigmatized, which creates a sense of shame when we’re expressing what we want, what we lust for.

Sex is still left in that dark corner as if it didn't exist. Sex and the pleasure that comes with it is seen a dirty thing, something to keep in the sphere of our private lives. A lot of people are afraid, maybe because of moral repercussions, and so don't pursue their desire. This is a shame because if everyone was more open and accepting about sexuality the world would be a lot easier place to live in. Hopefully films like mine can illustrate to people that sex isn't this sinful, amoral activity but can actually be an act of love and mutual pleasure.

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I think if you want to see a change in society, you have to start with yourself first, which is why my films are so sex positive. Sex positivity is about cultivating an atmosphere that is liberal and accepting, open, tolerant, and progressive towards sex, sexual topics and sexuality. Being sex positive means you aren't afraid of any aspect of your personality and are open to the ever-changing nature of human life, not just saying ‘I'm straight’, or ‘I'm gay’. With an open attitude towards sex your horizons broaden and you become accepting of all sexualities - you can really learn about yourself.

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Why do you think this year the Sexual Health Week theme was porn?

Because porn is the new sex ed. Plain and simple and as crazy as it sounds. The question of whether pornography should be part of modern sex education misses the point: that ship has sailed. Porn is already the new sex ed. And the type we are seeing – because it’s free – includes depictions of verbal and physical aggression towards women, unrealistic body types, and toxic depictions of gender.

However, pornography is not bad per se. My project XConfessions.com as well as work by other indie directors have been very successful during recent years, and they bring pleasure, confidence and sex positivity to men and women. As everything else, it all depends on the perspective – the way sex is shot and treated on screen. Sex is amazing and it should be treated better. Add art direction, good scripts, good locations, chemistry between actors, and the results can be so erotic and sexy! No need for gratuitous degradation, racist stereotypes, racialised language and stupid gender roles. Teens and young adults need to know there are other options if they want to watch porn.

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A lot of young people use porn to learn about sex – do you do anything in your porn making to ensure that young people aren’t getting the wrong sexual health messages?

The internet and tube sites, such as YouPorn and RedTube, have increased competition between producers and performers. With increased pressure on production companies and performers to stand out, more and more extreme and ridiculous scenes that have nothing to do with real sex are being produced in hopes of gaining a larger audience. As a result, people are exposed to a type of pornography which can warp their view on what sex should be. 

Those images aren’t images that teens and young adults should just normalise and associate with the relationships they’ll experience. Erotic films should be viewed by people over 18 and they’re meant to be entertainment, not sex ed, but the fact of the matter is that many teenagers are exposed to porn before that age. This is a problem especially when teens don't have access to decent sex education resources. There’s a danger that they’ll copy the behaviours and acts portrayed in the mainstream films because they’re more easily accessed.

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My films are made exclusively for erotic purposes and definitely not for educative reasons, so I don't really make an erotic film thinking it will be used as a sex education resource. What I do make sure to include is mutual respect and pleasure, which is essential in real life love making too and so in that way I know I'm not perpetrating any dangerous messages. Sex doesn’t have to be with someone you love, but it is always better when it is with someone you trust and who treats you with respect.

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• “I am tired of living in a world where women are mostly referred to as a man’s past, present or future property/ possession. I… do not. Belong. To anyone. But myself. And neither do you.” - Ariana Grande

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• "I actually love the dynamic of us [her and Sia] both being in [the studio] and just f**king being bossy... And it's all these male producers, and they're all f**king sh*tting themselves 'cause we're in there." - Adele

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